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Poster: light into ashes Date: Nov 20, 2012 1:16pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: DEAD women...

I've read similar things - though perhaps it's better to say not that men are "better listeners," but that they are often more "analytical listeners."
Your small sampling of deadhead girls who "love the dead but are nowhere near the point of searching for new great dead or listening closely for the intricacies" rings very true, I think.
And male deadheads are vastly more likely to collect walls of tapes or CDs of Dead shows... That kind of music collecting seems more like a male trait to me, as well as closely analyzing the music in a way that many male writers do.

The flip side is that rock or jazz music is very male-dominated as far as musicians, too. So perhaps it's natural that the audience reflects that. The Dead may be illustrating a cultural trend that's larger than just how people listen to music, or how many single people go to shows, etc.

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Poster: wisconsindead Date: Nov 20, 2012 1:38pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: DEAD women...

Yes more analytical listeners would be a more proper way to phrase it.

I personally think it is a phenotype (a visible expression) of brain chemistry and structure. Out of all of my dead head friends I am basically the only one who really pursues this music. I do have a buddy who is close to me in his ability to hear things, I just dont think he catagorizes and organizes all of it like i choose to do. Clementine is the only person I've met who really pursues this music like I do. In fact I'd say he's probably even a bigger dead head than I.

All that being said, I think most of the guys still lack what in my opinion makes someone a true dead nut, like you LIA lol. I wonder if men are more prone to collect than women... Tough to say. There are cultural and societal influences which drive different trends in music listening for men vs. women. All in all I still think that brain structure and chemistry is the major component of this discrepancy of listening between males and females.

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Poster: clementinescaboose Date: Nov 23, 2012 7:27am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: DEAD women...

I think you make some pretty interesting points regarding the biological differences about perception of music. It may be hard to have this conversation without resorting to stereotypes or even sexism, but the problem is my experience is pretty much exactly the same.

I think a more accurate way to put it also is that men are better listeners when it comes to different elements of music than women. Like LIA says, men might be more analytical listeners, in that we appreciate the elements of music that have to do with instruments and instrumental interaction far more. This seems to give many men a more emotional response than the aspects of music that give women this response.

I think many women respond much more to the lyrical content or the 'feel' of a song, rather than the individual instruments underpinning it.

For example my gf (and the vast majority of women I know) don't usually have much of a response to long jams or the instrumental parts of a song or get super into 'jam bands' or jazz. She rarely talks about it or discusses the merits of it; she has basically come out and said before that she feels that type of music doesn't really have all that much (or as much) merit. But put on one of her favorite artists like Bright Eyes or Ani DiFranco and she will go on and on about the symbolism and lyrical complexities and meanings and messages of the songs, whereas I could generally give a rat's ass about that type of stuff, and a lot of it goes right over my head.

This post was modified by clementinescaboose on 2012-11-23 15:24:34

This post was modified by clementinescaboose on 2012-11-23 15:27:03

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Nov 20, 2012 6:24pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: DEAD women...

Men are definitely more prone to collect than women, in certain areas... Among people I know, some women collect shoes, or ornaments - whereas some men collect vinyl albums, or movies. (I can't say I often saw women running those old record stores either - tended to be some crusty old guy, or in bigger stores, guys who were in bands...)
I'd say the Dead definitely inspired male-type traits among their fans - such as, say, collecting every show, or obsessively writing about them, or compiling huge setlist archives. Female Deadheads, in comparison, are a rather silent minority!
To look at it another way - how many female tapers did anyone see at a Dead show? A single one?

The 'jazzy' side of the Dead figures in this, too... There are plenty of rock bands that attract lots of female fans. (Looks are probably a factor!) The Dead weren't really known as a 'dance band,' I think (other than their core fans - outsiders often despised 'deadhead dancing') - but they were known for endless instrumental noodling.
The jazz field has far fewer female fans than rock (as far as I know), and the Dead probably drew the same kind of male attention as the famous jazz players, while repelling the ladies who wanted to dance to pop hits. That's just a theory, though.

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Nov 20, 2012 7:40pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Tapers

Joani Walker. Judy Lee. That's two tapers. Others than Betty :-)

Judy and Ken Lee worked as a team; what about Joanie Walker? Her tapes are always with Paul Scotton.

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Poster: light into ashes Date: Nov 20, 2012 8:08pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Tapers

I suspect Ken was the driving force behind the Ken & Judy tapes (though Judy, I think, was the one who actually held the microphones).
Joani Walker - good one; I don't know whether she taped by herself or as a team w/ Paul.
Betty, of course, started out as part of the Bob & Betty team as Matthews trained her, and eventually got skilled enough to start taping on her own.

Though they weren't tapers per se, I should also mention Ron & Susan Wickersham, who founded the Alembic music-equipment company along with Bear. She wrote this little history of the company -
http://www.alembic.com/family/history.html
You can tell right away there must have been some bad blood between her & Bear because she does not mention him at all! Despite the company being his idea. (See also the brief comments by Bear here - http://archive.org/post/240947/alembic-history )

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Poster: CharlieMiller Date: Nov 24, 2012 11:10pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Tapers

Paul Scotton is not a taper, he's friend with Joani and she gave him her tapes when she became ill.

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Poster: AltheaRose Date: Nov 25, 2012 12:18am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Tapers

Sorry to hear about her being ill. She's a real pioneer and must be an amazing woman. Her work is really appreciated, and it's neat to know that she's the taper independently.

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Poster: ColdRain108 Date: Nov 20, 2012 2:21pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: DEAD women...

seems to go hand-in-hand with the bong hit thing...Almost all the girls I knew 25 years ago have completely stopped puffin' the dragon...while only .00000001% of the same sampling of guys have stopped that habit.

Might be brain chemistry...